Archive for the ‘Creation and Evolution’ Category

There really isn’t much to comment upon in Bruce Gerencser’s 9th post in his My Journey series. This post is entitled I Can’t Believe Bruce Doesn’t Believe.  The following statement caught my attention:

“When it comes to Christianity the less you know the better. Just believe. Don’t question anything. Just have faith. Don’t doubt. Doubt is Satan’s way of leading people astray.”

I disagree.

Oh, I agree that doubt is Satan’s way of leading people astray. That goes without saying. One of the very first sentences he utters in the Scriptures is “Did God really say?” He followed that up by denying God’s Word entirely and casting God as the villain. So, yeah, I’d say that he uses doubt to lead people away from the faith.

Furthermore, statistical research suggests that doubt is at the root of the reason why many our churched youth quit church. Summarized in the book, Already Gone: Why Your Kids Will Quit Church & What You Can Do To Stop It, this research reveals that while 95% of our kids attended church regularly during their elementary and middle school years, only 55% were still attending during high school. This means that about 40% of the kids in our churches are already gone before high school. Their decision to abandon the faith correlates with the educational level at which they first began to doubt the history of the Bible. In fact, of those who no longer believe that all of the accounts and stories in the Bible are true, 39.8% first had doubts in middle school, an additional 43.7% first had their doubts in high school, while a mere 10.6% had their first doubts during college. About 90% of those kids went to public school. And guess what they start teaching hot and heavy in middle school? Evolution and millions of years – the latter being the key issue here. After being presented with an uncritical, one-sided account of the all-natural origins of the universe [and, in many cases, being told that this all-natural origins account of millions of years of microbes-to-man evolution is compatible with the biblical account of supernatural creation], these kids began to doubt the authority and veracity of the Bible.

So to state the painfully obvious, doubt leads to apostasy. This is pretty much a no-brainer, but what kind of doubt? Almost all Christians have moments of doubt, but this does not guarantee they will leave the faith. So what kind of doubt leads to apostasy?

Unanswered doubt, the kind of doubt that cannot seem to find a satisfactory answer.

Which is why I disagree with the notion that when it comes to Christianity, the less you know the better. I personally think that Christianity can stand up to anyone’s questions. Once I began subjecting it to scrutiny after my long absence from the church scene, after I had shed the credulous husk of my youth and begun to truly think for myself, I could find no objection that did not have a reasonable answer. Ours has always been a reasonable faith supported by weight of argument and evidence. In my experience, those who have little knowledge of apologetics or how to defend their faith are most prone to leave over doubts. There are also those who suppose that the Bible will always provide absolute, unassailable answers. Yet if we are to approach God by faith, not pure deduction, we might expect reasonable answers but not always definitive answers – else the requirement of faith would be made moot by the surety of knowledge.

This is not to say we should not expect reasonable answers. There are always reasonable answers, if we are willing to give Christianity the benefit of the doubt. For example, later in his post, Bruce laments:

“In my previous life I thought I had reached the end of the journey. I was waiting for the big payday in the sky. Now life is an unscripted, yet to be written journey. It remains to be seen where I’ll end up.

Bruce, aren’t you afraid of hell? No, I am not. I think the only hell there is is on this earth. Hell is caused by the machinations of wicked human beings and not devils, demons, or gods.

I see no evidence for a “He has a wonderful plan for your life” God. I refuse to embrace a god who thinks a wonderful plan includes suffering, devastation, pain, and death. I much prefer the “sh*t happens” approach to life. I can embrace and live with such a view of life. Life happens whether I am ready for it or not. There is no god pulling the divine strings of my life.”

I must first note that I disagree entirely with his assessment. If he supposed he had reached the end of his journey as a Christian and was simply waiting for his pie-in-the-sky, he missed a crucial element of authentic Christianity. You see, Jesus declared that He came to give us abundant life. This life we live isn’t meant to be cloistered. It’s meant to be shared. We are meant to love and disciple others and the journey is a great adventure all its own. If he supposed that he had somehow arrived, what did he make of Paul’s declaration that he never counted himself to have arrived, but rather, forgetting the past [including past achievements and failures], he pressed on for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus?

Yet this false sense of having arrived, simply because one has made a declaration of faith, been baptized and begun attending church is pervasive through church culture. We are called to make disciples of the world, yet according to Barna Research, the majority of Christians go throughout their entire lives without ever having led even one person to Christ! Do we suppose there is a section in heaven for the Scorched Yet Scarcely Saved? Have we not read the parable of the talents and the warning regarding the fellow who came to his Lord empty handed? What unprofitable servants we have become! And these same Christians look to churchified motivational speakers like Joel Osteen in search of the abundant life that only comes in fulfilling your calling to be a disciple and to make disciples!

I digress.

Note that Bruce laments he cannot bring himself to “embrace a god who thinks a wonderful plan includes suffering, devastation, pain, and death.” The question of a loving, omnipotent God and the existence of suffering has often been considered. Skeptics consider it a pretty good objection to the existence of the Biblical God. Theologians have offered varying answers, many of which I agree with, some of which I do not. The average guy in the pew supposes that we’ll discover the answer to this apparent paradox when we get to heaven.

I submit that the most reasonable answer has already been provided in the very first book of the Bible. We’ve already alluded to it. The Bible says that God created everything in six normal calendar days and then when He finished He declared His creation “very good.”

Of course, a lot of Christians have abandoned the history of Genesis, supposing that the all-natural origins story of millions of years of microbes-to-man evolution must be true instead. As Christians, they still cannot get over the undeniable fact that the Bible teaches that God is the Creator of all things, but if they suppose that God used evolution – a process of death, suffering, mutation and, according to uniformitarian geology, several mass extinctions – they are essentially painting God out to be an ogre, for what sort of God calls such a world of death and suffering “very good?”

The Bible paints a different picture of the Creator. While God’s original creation was very good, man rebelled against Him in the Garden. Since man had been given dominion over all creation, as a kingdom suffers for the bad decisions of its king, all creation fell under the curse, the punishment for his sin. The Bible teaches that death, suffering and thorns entered the world by Adam’s sin. The world was very good, but now there’s something wrong with the world. As a result of Adam’s sin, thorns, predation, natural disasters, death, suffering and all manner of evils entered the world.

Yet the worst evil in the world dwelt in man’s heart. The world’s first murder was committed within the first generation. To use Bruce’s turn of phrase, the evil machinations of man’s heart made a hell of earth. Seeing that the intent of man’s heart was only continually evil, God sent a worldwide flood to destroy all that drew breath on land, assuring the destruction of every man, except Noah and his family who found grace in God’s sight. Noah and those aboard the Ark were spared, but the flood destroyed everything else.

Biblical Creationists believe that the fossil record is largely a record of the judgment of God on a fallen world. While the world contains much beauty and evidences the power, glory and existence of God, what remains is a fallen world scarred by the effects of the Genesis Flood.

Those who compromise the clear teachings of God’s Word regarding Creation, the Fall and the Flood mean well; they simply want to remove any impediments to acceptance of the Gospel in a scientific age. Yet the imposition of the ideas of millions of years of microbes-to-man evolution have some undeniable conclusions for our theology: God has used death, mutation, pain and suffering to bring about His Will; the unexplainable existence of pain and suffering makes Him a somewhat detached, possibly ogrish deity; He cares more about the Big Picture than the little details or the process in that He created man via microbes-to-man evolution. This is where Bruce gets the idea that God does not concern Himself with our personal day-to-day lives; that there is no plan for our lives. Yet most Christians would object to these observations by appealing to supernatural revelation over natural revelation. We would note that God originally created the world perfect but that death, pain and suffering entered the world by man’s sin and that Nature reveals the glory, power and existence of God but it no longer reveals His nature and character as the original state [and promised future state] of creation does; that God is good and a rewarder them that diligently seek Him; and that He cares enough about the small details of creation to note the number of our hairs and when each sparrow falls. In doing this, we appeal to the superior [ultimate] revelation of Scripture over any philosophy or idea of fallible man, which is what those who compromised Genesis with millions of years and/or evolution should have done instead. You see, only in a literal historical Genesis do we have an answer for death and suffering in this world, much less hope for an ultimate remedy to this problem. Only in a literal historical Genesis do we have reason to expect the loving God who rewards them that diligently seek Him as painted elsewhere in the Bible. And the picture the Bible paints does provide a reasonable answer for the existence of both a loving, omniscient God and a world filled with suffering, violence and death; just as it promises that creation will one day be restored to its original “very good” state.

Be ready at all times to give an apologia [reasoned defense] for the hope that is in you,

Tony Breeden

 

I grew up in church. Church is not God ~ and thank God for that!

Like a lot of kids who grew up in church, I “got saved” many times. I believe I was sincere each & every time. I also think that it was a mark of my own insecurity & the awareness of growing up that led me to seek salvation anew; after all, I was just a kid last year; I was much more mature this year, right?

I got baptized even more than that. I’ve been dunked forwards, backwards – I’ven even been double dunked. Most of these immersions, admittedly, had something to do with the possibility of relief from the summer heat and with the attention gained by such dunkings, but a few were serious. I recall one particular incident in the winter that was either very serious or just not well thought out. In any case, wise to our possible intentions, those adults administering the baptisms took to a habit of justifying our deed by holding us down until we REALLY repented!

While all of these events tend to muddle together into one distorted childhood memory, I do clearly recall the last time I got saved as a child. My family lived in a trailer somewhere in WV. I couldn’t sleep that night, because I just kept thinking, “If I die before I wake… Is that a joke?!?” Every time I closed my eyes, an implacable force both pressed down upon me and made me wieghtless all at once. It felt as if I were being dragged off into the void of Deep space, while someone tried to crush me out of existence. I was afraid that if I died that very night that this would be my fate! My mother assured me that this was only a nightmare, for there were only two possible post-mortem destinations: Heaven (which sounded pleasant enough) and Hell. Yes, Hell. Not a metaphor. Not a bad acid trip. A real place of torment and agony, full of flames and sinners, where you never, ever wake up! Given the options, I chose the less painful one. (Fire insurance anyone?)

At the age of 16, I began going to a Christian school. My father had felt the call to preach that year and had decided that his children should receive better Christian instruction than we’d received previously. We’d always been VERY active in church. I’d been singing in church since I was four. We’d helped with tent revivals and the like. My extended family is jam-packed with gospel singers and preachers. I digress. Yet Dad didn’t feel a Christian education by proxy was adequate. He also wanted us brought up with a Biblical rather than Darwinian worldview. My public school science teachers had openly mocked my parents’ Biblicist views on Genesis when I brought it up in class [so much for a student's rights to voice his religious views and for scientific freedom of inquiry!].

Being in a Christian school doesn’t automatically guarantee you’ll be a SUPER CHRISTIAN, even if it’s a fundamentalist Christian school. It doesn’t even mean that you’re a Christian. (Marilyn Manson went to a Christian school.) I was serious about Christianity, but many of my peers thought the whole thing was a joke.

I learned about such faith giants as DL Moody and George Meuller. I learned about Jim Elliot, and other missionaries and martyrs, who paid the ultimate price for their salvation. I memorized entire chunks of the Bible, from Genesis to Revelation. I discovered not only my Biblical roots, but also the rest of my spiritual and historical heritage. I felt a sense of pride to know that I was a Christian. This is my heritage! This is what I believe! This is why I believe it! While at Christian school, at the age of 16, I felt the call to preach God’s Word.

I’ve related all fo this to make a point. If I had remained a Christian from that day forth, an argument for belief due to social conditioning could potentially be made. I was deep into fundamental Bible-believing Christian culture. This is full disclosure.

So is the rest of the tale…

While part of my reasons for abandoning my faith had much to do with my disillusionment with the church (Sorry, that will have to wait for some later post), Darwinism was the wedge that eventually shattered that faith. After a couple years of formal Christian education, my parents relented to my younger brothers’ pleas to go back to public school. In high school, Darwinism pervaded nearly everything they taught us. It was clearly indoctrination. My problem is that I wanted to be thought of as smart. After my first few skirmishes with condescending pro-Darwin teachers, I kept my mouth shut. Then in the absence of an alternative or even a critical look at some of Darwinism’s flaws, I began to slowly but surely slide into a belief that perhaps God could have used evolution [since all of the authority figures in my life seemed so convinced of evolution as a fact].

I didn’t know it at the time, but the things I found so convincing back then were all mostly lies and propaganda. Pictures of peppered moths [glued] on tree bark. Haeckle’s famously fudged embryo drawings. The Tree of Life drawing which never once hinted about its notoroiusly missing links; why didn’t someone tell me it was mostly speculation? The geological age strata cutaway chart showing the ages ["a gazillion billion years ago"] and a neat march of macroevolution from microbes to man laid out in the fossil record. Colorful pictures illustrating the mythological evolutionary tree of life. That over-used Ascent of Man chart showing a monkey at one end, a human at the other and a bunch of ape-men which never existed in the middle. The now-disproven vestigial organs canard. I was told in no uncertain terms that Darwinism [macroevolution, though it was never termed as anything but evolution] was a fact [as proven by... microevolution!?? Wait a minute! That's a bait-and-switch!] of science and science was how we’d gotten technology like video games, microwave ovens and cable. This equivocation of macroevolution with microevolution [it was always just called "evolution"], [this amalgamated] evolution with science and science with progress and intelligence came with a not-so-subtle equivocation of the Genesis Record with myth or superstition. Science [and the amalgam evolution concept] was juxtaposed with religion [as pre-scientific and superstitious explanations of the world]. Of course, I didn’t realize I was being indoctrinated to buy this scientific evolution versus Biblical myth false dichotomy. But eventually it began to have an affect on my beliefs.

At first, I satisfied myself with some sort of uneasy compromise between the two origins worldviews. I didn’t bother asking deep questions.  What I hadn’t considered was that, like Adam and Eve, I was listening to Satan’s question, “Has God really said?” I’d decided that one part of the Bible wasn’t true based on the wisdom of men, most of whom were dead.  That led me to question whether other parts of the Bible were true. It led me to toss out much of Genesis, most of early Israel’s Biblical history and Jonah’s fish story. I carefully kept away from criticizing the Gospels, just in case. But I began equating the Bible and religion and even God as increasingly irrelevant to modern life [being pre-scientific explanations of the world], to my life. It didn’t help that I’d come out of fundamentalist subculture who’s increasing hostility to the culture, vividly undeniable hypocrisy [Baker, Swaggart, TBN in general], isolationism and crazy rule-mongering led me to see the church as increasingly irrelevant as well!

I should’ve kept my eyes on God. I realize now that all of this internal conflict was evidence that I had a commitment to a religion rather than a relationship with Christ. After all, if I had truly known Him, how could I have ever left Him? The busy-ness of church had blinded me to the fact that I was doing a lot for Christianity, doing everythinf in His Name, but that I simply didn’t know Him.

Instead, I dropped out. Unwilling to hurt my parents’ feelings, I continued to go to church for a while, to sing, and oh-so-rarely to preach, but the fire was gone. By the time I graduated high school, I had dropped out completely.

I gloried in my ability to “think for myself”, and couldn’t stomache the carbon copy cool conformity of Christian society. I also couldn’t stand my own hypocrisy when I was there, white-washed on the outside, but hollow and rotting on the inside.

Finally, I turned my back on God. How could I trust the Bible if it was so full of holes? I accepted some sort of fuzzy notion about God and would readily identify that God as Jesus if pressed, but He wasn’t really MY God. I became a back-sliding stereotype. I began smoking, cussing, and drinking. I grew my hair out. I threw wild parties. I used God’s name as a swearword every chance I got. I experimented with the occult, particularly runes. I loved the works of H.P. Lovecraft & similar authors. I even perverted my God-given drawing & writing talents, creating morbidly occult fiction & often demonic artwork for band fliers and mere personal amusement. I was the meanest, most spiteful, most cynical person I’ve even known. Even though I was cocky & arrogant in public, I often suffered horrible depression & the aforementioned rage in private. I tried not to let any hint of my true emotions slip through my armor, but I was hurting horribly inside.

I was at my worst when I was the lead vocalist/songwriter for a hardcore/rapcore band called Midian, which I more or less founded. Certainly, it wouldn’t have survived without me, for I wrote almost all of the lyrics (we wrote nearly 100 songs in our brief year & a half of existence; less than 10 of these songs were not written by me), made all of the contacts, promoted the band via fliers, radio, and various publications, booked our concerts, and put together multi-band concerts. Midian was my choice for the band’s name, which is perhaps ironic, since this was my time “on the backside of the desert”. Later, we briefly changed the name to Hate, I Preach. We did covers of Marilyn Manson, Korn, Rage Against the Machine, & others of our genré, but 95% of our shows were comprised of originals, some of which made those cover tunes seem tame by comparison. Aside from the previously mentioned bands, our influences & idols also included Metallica, Iron Maiden, The Doors, Cypress Hill, The Misfits (later Danzig), Megadeth, Faith No More, & Type O Negative.

Anyway I simply wanted to give you a glimpse of who I was for a decade. Some claim that once you get saved, you’re always saved ~ that you can never lose your salvation no matter what you do. I seriously believe that had I died during that time, I would have went straight to Hell. Do not Pass Go. Do Not Collect $100. I know that now. I knew it then. In any case, I was definitely no longer a Creationist. Social conditioning via scholastic indoctrination had the intended effect. This, by the way, is why we need to teach the controversy in public schools.

It took a bit of old-fashioned EXTORTION to get me back into church. I was poor. I had no food. I hadn’t eaten in several days. Since I didn’t have a job, it didn’t look like there was gonna be any food in my future either. They say that sin is fun for a season. My season apparently was up. God had had enough of my running.

Mom made me an offer I couldn’t refuse. She said, “Son, you know the church I go to has a FOOD pantry. If you come to church, we’ll fix you up couple bags of groceries. But if you don’t… well, it’s your decision!” she finished cheerily. Talk about an incentive to change!

So I went to church.

But I didn’t make it easy on them. After all, I had made up my mind about how I felt about Church and Christianity.

Yet to my shock and surprise, they actually listened to my gripes and accusations about the Church & its Christians. No one judged me. No one wrote me off as hopeless or “too far gone”. They treated me like a person ~ not a no-good, dirty, rotten sinner. Nor did they treat me in that patronzing “I-told-you-so” manner that is usually reserved for backsliders. In fact, a few became good friends of mine before I started attending regularly. Needless to say, I’m now VERY big on “friendship evangelism.” Through half a year of conversations, i began to realize that I had somehow decided how I felt about Christianity and church culture without really evaluating how I felt about God. As they patiently answered my questions and objections, I stumbled upon the fact that I’d never really known the Jesus who was portrayed in the Bible. I knew a stained-glass Sunday school version of Him that we were all supposed to emulate, but the bold, out-spoken, controversial Christ of the Bible… This guy was amazing! How had the church managed to keep this scandalous God-man a secret?

A year after my first co-erced visit, I gave my life and my heart my life to God on March 23, 1997. The preacher talked about the “Blood Covenant” we make with God upon salvation, as if the Invitation on Heaven’s Door reads: “Whosoever Will may Come” but upon entering we find that the other side of the sign reads: “Foreordained from the Foundation of the World!” I somehow knew that this was my last chance. I’m not a fool. I went to the altar crying (something I hadn’t done in years) and got up preaching (I had to let it all out) and ultimately changed.

Now I had a problem. I had come back to Christendom based on the evidence for Jesus’ resurrection and fulfilled prophecy, but I still had a fuzzy notion of Biblical authority. How could I trust it for salvation but not for what it said about why I needed to be saved in the first place, that we have all sinned in Adam? As Jesus asked Nicodemus, How could I trust him concerning heavenly things if I couldn’t hear him on what he said about earthly things?

So I began re-examining Genesis. Most of http://DefGen.org is a written exploration of my conclusions. The issue of origins isn’t one of faith versus reason, but rather which reasonable faith [Darwinism or Creationism] is ore reasonable given our shared pool of data and our common capacity from reason.

You see, I’m a thinker. At long last. I thought I knew how to think for myself when I reject the social conditioning of my religious childhood for Darwinism, but I really just fell prey to the more immersive [and therefor more comprehensive and conditionally compelling] social conditioning of scholastic indoctrination in public schools. I didn’t learn to think for myself by believing what they told me; I learned independent thought by daring to critique and question what I’d been told [an art never taught in public school] and making my own decisions. The Bible’s account simply better fits the facts of the observable world.

-Rev Tony Breeden

Bruce Gerencser’s second post in the My Journey series, My Testimony, deals with two separate issues:

1. The pointlessness of much of what we call church ministry

2. His conclusions on the Bible

We dealt with the former issue in our last post, Church Outside Four Walls. In this post, we deal with the latter issue.

In My Testimony, Bruce makes a stratling admission:

“To be a Christian means you believe the Bible to be the word of God. To be a Christian means you embrace the beliefs and teachings of the Christian faith. Since I do not believe the Bible to be the Word of God, and I no longer embrace the beliefs and teachings of the Christian faith,I am no longer a Christian.

My deconversion came at the moment where I finally admitted to myself that I no longer believed the Bible to be the word of God. As I have often said, It really is all about the Bible.”

What started him down this path? He sheds further light elsewhere in that post:

I’ve come to the conclusion that the Bible, as great of a book as it is, is not the inerrant, inspired word of God. At best, the Bible is a spiritual guide and a book of mythical stories written by men thousands of years ago. It is not a book that is overly relevant to the world that we live in today. The stories make for great reading but they offer little real practical wisdom for moderns in a 21st-century. I still enjoy reading the Sermon on the Mount, Ecclesiastes, and the Psalms. There is wisdom to be had from the Bible but it is certainly not a book that one can govern their life by.

I came to see that the Christian church’s attempt to prop up the Bible was a house of illusions. Instead of confronting the fallibility of the text and the many errors within that text, the Christian church instead developed convoluted and humorous explanations for the perceived errors and contradictions in the Bible. Explanations like….. inerrant in the originals.”

The orthodox position of Christendom is that the Bible is inerrant in the original autogrpahs and that God has preserved His Word as it has been passed down. A lingering bias of King James Only-ism seems to have kept him from accepting an orthodox position [see next quote].

He certainly does not tell us which alleged errors or contradictions he found in the Bible, so we cannot address those. Perhaps he is more transparent in later posts, but his charges are void for vagueness at this point.

In any case, I cannot fail to note that he called the Bible a “book of mythical stories written by men thousands of years ago.” This is a direct contradiction of the Bible’s claim that no prophecy of Scripture ever came by the will of men, but holy men of old spoke as they were moved of the Holy Ghost [2 Peter 1:21]. How might he have come to this conclusion that the Bible is a purely human book? The very phrase “mythical stories” is suggestive of the fact that he accepted millions of years of microbes-to-man evolution and then rejected the Genesis record of Creation and the Flood.

In his first installment of the My Journey series, Why I Retired From The Ministry, Bruce listed one of his reasons for leaving the ministry as:

  • Changing understanding of the Bible. I started out the ministry as a King James Only, every word is inerrant believer. I have come to understand that such a belief is not only unsustainable theologically but absolutely irrational. I no longer use the Bible as a science or history textbook and I no longer need to read any particular systematic theology into the text in order to enjoy reading the Bible. I simply enjoy reading the Biblical narrative for its own sake. It now speaks to me in ways I never thought possible.

Now, I am King James Preferred and I have never preached out of any Bible save the King James, but I tend to shudder at the very idea of King James Only-ism. Why? Because I cannot fathom why someone would suppose that God wanted the Bible in English to preserved in an increasingly anachronistic variant of English, when He wants the whole world to read and understand His Word.

Yet note that he ststes that he no longer uses the “Bible as a science or history textbook.” This is a common argument from those who affirm millions of years and/or evolution. This is evidence that his rejection of the Bible began with an acceptance of millions of years of evolution.

Note the sobering consequences of rejecting the ultimate authority of the Word of God, as recounted by Bruce Gerencser himself:

“Robert Price said that once a person stops believing that the Bible is the Word of God they are on a slippery slope where there is no natural stopping place. That’s where I find myself. For a time I was content to call myself a progressive, liberal Christian. As I continued to slide down the slippery slope I thought that maybe Universalism was the answer…  But, at the end of the day, Universalism did not satisfy me and I came to a place where it was time to stop calling myself a Christian.”

Think about it. he went from fundamentalist to liberal Christian to Universalist to, in his own words, “a Bible denying, Christ denying agnostic.” Worse still, while Bruce tentatively affirms deism at the writing of My Testimony, he currently identifies himself as a full-blown atheist!

We must remember that it really does come down to whether one’s ultimate authority is God’s Word or man’s.

Preacher